E-mail a friendDon Siegelman
airdate April 22, 2008
Don Siegelman served in Alabama politics for 26 years. He's the only person to be elected to serve in all four of the state's top offices: secretary of state, attorney general, lieutenant governor and governor. He was noted for his work in improving education, children's services and promoting anti-crime initiatives. In '07, the once-popular Democrat was convicted of corruption charges and sentenced to more than seven years in federal prison. Siegelman was recently released pending his appeal.
Former Alabama governor, who was recently released from prison, explains his case. (3:09)
Don Siegelman
Tavis: Don Siegelman is the former governor of Alabama who was sentenced to jail in 2006 on charges of bribery, conspiracy, and obstruction. However, serious doubts about his case have been raised over the past few months, and just three weeks ago a judge ordered Governor Siegelman to be released from prison.
Fifty-two former state attorney generals, including Republicans and Democrats, have asked Congress to investigate this case and just last Thursday the House Judiciary Community asked former White House adviser Karl Rove to testify about his possible role in this matter. Governor Siegelman joins us tonight from Birmingham. Governor, honor to have you on the program, sir. Thank you for your time.
Gov. Don Siegelman: Tavis, thank you so much.
Tavis: I'm glad to have you on. Let me start by asking, for those who have not been following this case as closely as those in Alabama, take me back a few years ago to what happened to you relative to these charges, and then we'll bring the story up to date.
Siegelman: Well, first let me say this is not so much about me or this case, but it's about America and it's about Congress now finding out who hijacked our Department of Justice and turned it into a political tool for winning elections. But specifically, what happened to me was that shortly after I endorsed Al Gore in 1999, Karl Rove's client began a state investigation.
Later in 2001, Karl Rove's business associate and political partner's wife, who was a U.S. attorney, started a federal investigation. We had other conflicts with Mr. Rove over the period of about four years, and his fingerprints kept coming up on virtually every critical stage of this proceeding, whether it was the investigation, the indictment, or the prosecution.
And it is clear that there is some involvement of Karl Rove, not only in this case but in the other cases that are being investigated by the Department of Justice and by the House Judiciary Community. But there have been other instances of U.S. attorneys being asked to investigate or to do damage to Democrats who are running for public office in this country.
Tavis: Where you are concerned, what then, his fingerprints notwithstanding, what, then, were the allegation and what were you found guilty of?
Siegelman: Well, as we - I was found guilty of accepting money for something called the Alabama Education Lottery campaign. This is no different than the president of the United States taking contributions to his campaign and then later appointing someone as the ambassador or to some board or agency.
I accepted a campaign contribution for the Alabama Education Lottery campaign and then appointed a gentleman named Richard Scrushy, who was then head of one of the largest healthcare companies in America, to a board that he had already served on for some 12 years and had been appointed to that board by three previous governors. It's also worth noting, I think, that not one single penny went to me, but went to the education lottery foundation.
We pointed out in our brief on appeal, the one that was just recently ruled on by the 11th Circuit, that we believe the judge gave the wrong jury instruction, and as was pointed out in "60 Minutes," the prosecution put on a witness whom they knew was going to give false testimony. So there's ample reason to believe that the conviction will be overturned on appeal.
Tavis: I want to stay with the original part of this case, so these allegations are levied against you, you're found convicted, you end up going to jail. What is the sentence?
Siegelman: I'm sorry, what is the sentence?
Tavis: Yeah, the sentence - when you were found guilty, the sentence was what?
Siegelman: Oh, the sentence was seven - about seven and a half years, again, for raising money for an education lottery. We were trying to establish a lottery so that all kinds in Alabama would be able to go to college for free.
Tavis: So seven and a half years, the sentence. You served how long of that so far?
Siegelman: I served nine months.
Tavis: Nine months. So you're out on appeal. Tell me more about what the appeal was based upon and why this ruling came down that allowed you to be talking to me tonight.
Siegelman: Well, I think the 11th circuit saw that there were substantial questions of law and fact that would likely result in a reversal on appeal, and without getting into too much detail the statute of limitations had passed, the fact that this was nothing more than an ordinary campaign contribution, and the Supreme Court has said that when you take money from people and then later appoint him to something that's not a bribe; that's just American politics.
So if you're going to put Don Siegelman in prison for this, then President Bush needs to get ready to go, as well as anybody that gave money and then got something - an appointment from the president or any other governor.
So it is nonsensical, and also turns common sense on its head, to believe that this kind of a - that this practice in American politics is suddenly now going to become a crime.
Tavis: What did Karl Rove have against Don Siegelman?
Siegelman: Well, I think - I had been secretary of State, attorney general, lieutenant governor, and governor. I had been successful in bringing in five automobile plants. We started a thousand new school construction projects, I was about to launch a campaign for reelection in a Republican state. I was endorsed - one of the only - I think, well, the only Democrat in the country endorsed personally by Charlton Heston.
I think I represented a threat to the Republicans here in Alabama and to some extent, nationally. I was getting ready to start chewing on George Bush. I was opposed to his policies in Iraq, his economic policies and education policies, and had given a speech to the National Democratic Governor's Association in December of 2002, and I was about to launch a campaign to help Democrats win across the country as they were running for Governor.
I think whether that was it, whether I represented a threat to the Republicans on a national level or whether it was just a personal issue between me and Karl Rove, I don't know. We had had a number of run-ins in Alabama beginning as far back as 1994.
But again, this is not so much about me or this case, Tavis, as it is about restoring the American peoples' faith in our criminal justice and our justice system. We have seen that our freedoms have been subverted by someone. Our democracy has been distorted by someone for political reasons. And it is up to Congress now to dig in and to find the truth.
And Congress has got to find out who is responsible for this. I believe it was Karl Rove. Saying that he wasn't involved is like saying George Bush isn't involved in the war in Iraq because he's not over there pulling the trigger. But Congress has now got to find out who is responsible and hold them accountable.
Tavis: Let me jump in right quick.
Siegelman: So that this doesn't happen again.
Tavis: No, I hear you, Governor, and I respect your point of view. Let me jump in because it occurs to me as I sit here listening to you talk about what Congress needs to do that where Karl Rove is concerned and any number of other persons, but let's just stick with Karl Rove, since his fingerprints, as you say, are on this case all the way around, let's just stare at Mr. Rove for just a second.
This guy has been accused of just about everything. Every charge you can imagine has been levied against this guy, and yet they have not gotten Karl Rove yet. Call him slippery if you will, but this guy's on TV every day, he's making money every day, he's writing books. He does whatever he wants to do, he's out of the White House, they have not been able to put their thumb on him as yet.
So I raise that to ask why you think in this case Congress can or Congress will, powers that are much higher than you, resources much deeper than yours, can finally get him on point?
Siegelman: Well, Tavis, I think for this reason. There was a Republican whistleblowers, a well-respected and established Republican lawyer who was part of the Republican political machine here in Alabama who has now come forward and has given sworn testimony to the United States Congress saying that she was part of a conversation when the husband of my prosecutor, the husband of the United States attorney who prosecuted me, said that he had talked to Karl and Karl had spoken to the Department of Justice, and for them not to worry about me.
That the Department of Justice was going to take care of Don Siegelman. So we have sworn testimony by a Republican insider that Karl Rove was involved in this prosecution. So Congress now has the responsibility, as John Conyers has acknowledged and has recently taken action to do to call Karl Rove before the committee and to have him testify.
He can either tell the truth, lie under oath, or plead the Fifth, but he needs to go before Congress and be subjected to questions by the House Judiciary Committee.
Tavis: I've got just a couple minutes to go. Let me close, Governor, by asking how, on a personal level, politics aside, how on a personal level you have navigated this journey. Here you are a former governor sitting in prison, and now of course you're out. We'll see where this case goes. But on a personal level, how have you navigated this journey?
Siegelman: Well, Tavis, I lost my freedom but I didn't lose my faith, primarily because my friends and family kept me uplifted. The national media spotlight on the injustices of not only this case but the other cases that we talked about, the actions by a courageous and a bold congressman, Congressman John Conyers, has focused the attention of the injustices on again not just on this case, that have occurred not only in this case but on other cases through the House Judiciary Committee.
So I was able to keep my spirits lifted, but of course it has taken me out of politics, it's cost me my entire life savings. But again, this is more - it's not about me and it's not about this case, it is about seeking and finding the truth of who hijacked the Department of Justice, holding those people accountable, and making an unequivocal statement on behalf of the people of this country that that kind of behavior will not be tolerated in America.
Tavis: Well, we covered earlier on this program, as our viewers know, the story of those fired U.S. attorneys, one of those persons on this program when this story broke a year or so ago, and now we are back to this same story about what the Department of Justice did under this Bush White House. And now the case of Don Siegelman goes forward. Governor, nice to have you on the program. All the best to you, and we'll continue to follow the case and see where this leads us.
Siegelman: Thank you, Tavis.
Tavis: Thank you for your time.
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