E-mail a friendJames Garner
airdate December 22, 2006
James Garner is a leading trial lawyer and a partner in a New Orleans firm. He's noted on several 'top lawyers' lists, including Best Lawyers in America, and was awarded the first annual Leadership in Law Award as one of the top 50 Lawyers in New Orleans. While attending Tulane Law School, Garner served as the Law Review's managing editor. Praised for his advocacy, he represented Xavier University and many individuals in lawsuits against insurance companies in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina.
James Garner
Tavis: James Garner is an attorney based in New Orleans who recently represented Xavier University and others in a critical case involving Katrina-related insurance claims. The good news for Xavier and thousands of residents in New Orleans came in a recent court ruling stating that insurance firms must pay for damages caused by flooding, the aftermath of the storm. James Garner joins us tonight from New Orleans. Mr. Garner, nice to have you on the program, sir, and congratulations.
James Garner: Thanks, Tavis. It's an honor and pleasure to be here.
Tavis: I say congratulations. Then again, I don't work for an insurance company.
Garner: (Laughter) Well, the judge's ruling made clear something we all already know. But for levy breaks, many in New Orleans, whether they be in the Lower Ninth Ward, in the Broadmoor area, in Materie, Jefferson Parish, Midcity, Lakeview, where Xavier is located off Carrollton Avenue, where, as you know, St. Katharine Drexel founded the school, is that broken levies had the hand of man in them. This was created, you know, by the Corps of Engineers essentially building bad levies. That's why you buy insurance.
Tavis: And yet I suspect there are those watching right now, maybe even yours truly included, who find this whole debate a bit incredulous. I mean, what are these institutions like Xavier and, moreover, residents of the city supposed to do when they pay these insurance premiums all these years and, through no fault of their own, they find themselves - I was going to say in harm's way, but it's much worse that.
They find themselves homeless in many cases; a debt, of course, brought to others. What are you supposed to do when you pay insurance premiums? I only raise that because, to a lot of folk, I suspect this entire argument sounds a bit stupid. Why do I have to fight my insurance company to get back on my feet?
Garner: Exactly. Many people, as you know, don't have the resources or the fortitude like Dr. Francis who, as you know, got the university back up and running on January 17 for many Xavier students. If you're an individual, it's fighting basically a vertical wall, and it's tough to fight insurance companies. Thank God that we had Judge Duval and others who were able to put up the fight so that the judge could do the right thing by the policyholders.
Tavis: Because - I'm so curious here and I suspect others may be as well, what did this case turn on? Put another way, what were the insurance companies claiming and what was your response?
Garner: Well, the insurance companies put in the policy many years ago what they call a "water exclusion." It read logically that it would exclude everything connected to water. Well, obviously, if a pipe breaks in your house, if you have a swimming pool in the back of your house and somehow it disconnects and flows into your house, that's covered. If a water reservoir - say you were out west and there's a reservoir that ruptures and that water rushes into your house, that's covered.
The insurance companies tried to say that, no matter how the water gets into your home, your university, the bread store, the shop you run, anywhere in the city of New Orleans, it's not covered. What they didn't do is, they didn't clearly specify that natural acts like Noah and the forty days and forty nights of rain created flooding, they didn't distinguish that from a man-made act. Here, badly built levies that were supposed to protect the city that ultimately caused the whole problem.
Tavis: And yet if I'm an insurance company CEO, perhaps what I'm thinking is that I don't ever, given this ruling that you wrested the other day out of this judge, I don't ever want to cover residents of New Orleans because there's a very great likelihood that somewhere down the road at some point in time, we may have some similar incident.
We pray God, not as bad as Katrina. We pray not ever again, but it is life. Things happen. If I'm an insurance company, I don't even want to cover you guys anymore, thanks to people like you wresting these kinds of ridiculous decisions.
Garner: Well, hopefully, they have more of a soul and spirit than that, and they're more honorable because, quite frankly -
Tavis: - hey, hey, this is business. This ain't about being honorable. I'm trying to make money here, man.
Garner: The whole theory, as you know, of insurance is to spread risk. Under that analysis, they're going to stop insuring New York City, which, as you know, is a potential threat for a hurricane being seven years from the Long Island Express of the 1930s? They're not going to insure the people in Sacramento, which is the next levy risk?
It may not be very popular to talk about, but the levies in Sacramento are at risk of rupturing just like the levies in New Orleans. And what happens if St. Louis has an earthquake? Are they not going to insure the people in St. Louis? I understand where you're coming from, and I've heard it on the streets of New Orleans, but that's why they're in business, to insure risk. They can't just cut and run when they have to pay a risk.
Tavis: Well, they can cut and run in advance and that's what I'm getting at. If in fact they think that insuring people now in the city of New Orleans is too high a risk to take, what happens long-term in New Orleans?
And to your point now, since you've heard - I was just asking the question; I'm not in New Orleans and obviously didn't know this was being discussed - what is the conversation about that in New Orleans? About what they're going to do going forward for those who are coming back to the city and want and need insurance?
Garner: Well, you're absolutely correct. Without insurance, you can't rebuild the city because no one is going to make a capital investment in the city.
Tavis: Exactly.
Garner: Not all insurers have done this. Chubb Insurance Company has been a great insurance company in New Orleans. It has worked with claims and has continued to write people. State Farm actually won before Judge Duval because they wrote their policies the right way. Allstate similarly had issues like that and is still writing in the city. Travelers announced that it's going to leave the city. Travelers happened to be the insurer against whom Xavier had its motion.
You're right. There are two impediments to rebuilding. One was the government getting down here and giving us money. The second is the insurance companies. That breaks into two parts. Do they pay the claims, one? And two, do they continue to write? If they abandon the city of New Orleans, if the insurance companies abandon the city of New Orleans, it's not going to be able to be rebuilt.
Tavis: As a resident of the city, tell me your personal story. Where were you when the storm came?
Garner: I was in Baton Rouge. I get upset about it because I had six feet of water in my house and my parents lost everything. I mean, I was with my grandmother in Baton Rouge, but my parents lost everything; my brother lost everything.
Tavis: How does it feel these days being there in the city? I was there I guess a few months ago. I haven't been there since then, but how does it feel being in the city right about now?
Garner: I'm personally reinvigorated. I think we got a chance to rebuild our city, correct the wrongs, do right by people, make it a better city. But at the same time, maintain our historical and cultural underpinnings, which make New Orleans great.
Tavis: I just read an article in "The New York Times" - I shouldn't even reference this because I can't recall the date - but it was a big front-page story in "The New York Times" just a couple of weeks ago that talked about the fact that the levy work, in fact, has started to slow. You might have seen this story.
They completed Phase One in New Orleans, but "The New York Times," in this particular story, is raising some questions about what happens now. Not that folk are altogether disinterested, but the pace of the work has slowed significantly on Phases Two, Three and Four.
Garner: Yeah, there was a recent article about funding. Some of these projects, for whatever reason, I don't know the details, are running into Congressional obstacles to get funded and, therefore, are causing the slowing of the work. That, hopefully, won't happen and, hopefully, the new Congress will make sure funding gets here and gets here at a faster rate.
Tavis: Well, if you're ever in New Orleans and need a good attorney (laughter), his name is James Garner. He wrestled a major settlement out of the insurance companies there in the Big Easy. Mr. Garner, nice to have you on the program. All the best to you, sir.
Garner: It's an honor and a pleasure. Thanks, Tavis.
Tavis: Thank you very much. Up next, from the City of Refuge Church here in Los Angeles, Bishop Noel Jones. Stay with us.
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